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citizens. >> we had address the drivers of the deficit, social security no not. >> social second has not added one penny to the deficit. >> senaaor reid and others have spoken out we'll not touch any of the entitlement. >> we should take social security off the table. neil: i could have gone on and on, many democrats are scratching any en tea entitlemes that includes social security, james roosevelt, i am wondering about this democratic resistance, we saw some cracks in that, as we saw republican cracks to taxes. you never know, to not have it on table or see it as necessary to address, it has to even worry a go i like you. >> it is good to be with you, again. yeah. social security should not be part of the deficit and tax discussion, social security did not as was said, did not contribute to the deficit. it is supported by the payroll taxes. that workers and their employers pay. >> you have seen, surveys that show the direct we're going, we -- the direction we're going we have moved its trouble date up, compared to other programs, that is prestine, my only point is why not put it ou
campaigned for re-election on the idea of a, quote, balanced approach, end quote, to deficit reduction, a mixture of tax increases and spending cuts. here's the plan that the republicans say you presented to them. >> i can tell you what i presented. it will be helpful. >> chris: let me -- >> it is our plan, let me do it. let me explain it. >> chris: i'd like to ask you about this part of it and you can tell me. >> okay. >> chris: $1.6 trillion in tax increases. more than $80 billion in new stimulus spending, next year, and, unspecified nonguaranteed spending cuts. question, is that your idea of balance. >> it is, let me explain what is in the explain they didn't report to you and explain, to people, which is, we propose alongside the trillion dollars in spending cuts we agreed with republicans, last year, on defense and a range of other government programs, proposed $600 billion of detailed reforms and savings, to our health care and other government programs, that is $600 billion. in fact, the health care savings in that plan, are larger than the plans we have seen republicans in the
, to deficit reduction. a mixture of tax increases and spending cuts. here's the plan that the republicans say you presented to them this week. >> i can tell you what i presented if it would be helpful. >> let me ask you. >> but it's our plan. why don't you let me do t why don't you let me explain it. >> well, i would like to ask you about this part of it and then anything i leave out you can tell me. 1.$6 trillion in tax increases, more than $80 billion in new stimulus spending next year, and an unspecified nonguaranteed spending cuts. question, is that your idea of balance? >> it is. let me explain what is in this plan that they didn't report to you and they didn't explain to people, which is we have proposed alongside the trillion dollars in spending cuts, we agreed with republicans last year on defense and other range ever programs, we proposed $600 billion of detailed reforms and savings to our healthcare and medicare programs. that's $600 billion. in fact, the healthcare savings in that plan are larger than the plans we've seen republicans in the past. >> is that what was in the budget?
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. tea party 2, the sequel. [ screaming ] oh grover! electric deficit boogaloo. 29 minutes after the hour. right back on "the stephanie miller show." alright, in 15 minutes we're going to do the young turks. i think the number one thing that viewers like about the young turks is that we're honest. they know that i'm not bs'ing them with some hidden agenda, actually supporting one party or the other. when the democrats are wrong, they know that i'm going to be the first one to call them out. they can question whether i'm right, but i think that the audience gets that this guy, to the best of his ability, is trying to look out for us. [ male announcer ] red lobster's crabfest ends soon. hurry in and try five succulent entrees like our tender snow crab paired with savory garlic shrimp. just $12.99. come into red lobster and sea food differently. and introducing 7 lunch choices for just $7.99. salads, sandwiches, and more. rich, chewy caramel rolled up in smooth milk chocolate. don't forget about that payroll meeting. rolo.get your smooth
at the same time. it's not very good for the long-term deficit. but as i always say, no one actually cares about the deficit. >> right. the -- there's a report out tonight that tim geithner made a fascinating proposal to boehner today which is basically get congress out of the debt ceiling game. mr. geithner proposed permanently ending congressional purview over the federal borrowing limit. republican aides revealed this. he said that congress could be allowed to pass a resolution blocking an increase in the debt limit, but that the president would be able to veto that resolution, and so then only a two-thirds -- two-thirds of lawmakers would be necessary to override a veto. put it -- put basically the debt ceiling into presidential veto land, as a spot where they would have influence. they will not go along with this. it is a brilliant and correct idea. >> it's a brilliant idea. and i think the fact that we're actually hearing democrats talk about the 14th amendment solution, saying the debt limit is unconstitutional in and maybe we'll go there and the fact we're actually hearing there is
to cut the deficit. and say republicans will have to give in. >> did speaker john boehner get the message? because the message was work together. >> they're not going to openly concede on this point this far out from the deadline, but they see the handwriting on the wall. >> reporter: late today, gop sources said that they have some details about the proposal brought here from tim geithner. they say the white house is offering $1.6 trillion in tax increases over ten years, 400 billion in cuts coming later. and no new proposals dealing with entitlement reform. republicans say for them, a nonstarter. >> kelly o'donnell, another cold night on capitol hill. thank you. >>> and as this debate goes on, a memorial service in washington today for a long-time budget-cutting warrior, former senator warren rudman, and david suitor was among them, and former senator and white house chief of staff, howard baker, a republican from new hampshire who authored a bill that included automatic spending cuts way back in '85. warren rudman went on to found the coalition that pushed for reducing the deficit. sen
different economy. what we have now is 8% unemployment. very sluggish growth and a trillion dollar deficit every year. you propose to raise taxes in that environment and you're not going to get growth. >> don't you understand you need to off set-- if you're serious about debt reduction, i think you are, don't you understand you need revenue and spending cuts. stuart: and how do you get revenues. >> how. >> please, go ahead, go ahead. stuart: it's easy you lower tax rates and keep incentive to work harder. >> we've tried that. stuart: and you can't-- what. >> george bush tried that. look at the deficit we had. stuart: well, wait a minute you cannot rewrite economic history. after george bush lowered tax rates the return to the treasury, the money coming into the treasury went way up and the deficit, by the way, in 2007 was 167 billion dollars. >> so. stuart: president obama has got, 167 billion a month just about. don't rewrite economic history, julie. >> i'm not rewriting economic history. stuart: you are. >> i'm not-- >> i'm telling you if you lower tax rates you'll get more revenue. >> t
of 2013-type solution. but the reality of dealing with this economy, its debt, it's deficit, spending priorities and all of that is not going to get done in the next five weeks. so let's be honest about that. i agree with you. i think that they're going to come to a short-term stopgap solution that deals with the cliff, that deals with the bush tax cuts that expire, that deal with the increase in unemployment rate that's due to hit in january. they'll deal with those short-term things, but the long-term systemic substantive points that need to be addressed will not get addressed in the next four weeks. >> steve, how would you markets respond if they decide we'll have a short-term fix but we haven't actually managed to come up with the real healthy response to what the economy needs? >> you're seeing a total kick the can. we really got nothing done this december, tough luck, we just want to extend it six months, i think the markets would be jittery but would probably accept it. going over the cliff -- and we were talking about this the other night in washington with a bunch of ceos," g
the debt and deficit. >> so was this proposal the white house made yesterday with more spending and very few spending cuts, was that what mr. sorenson was expecting out of the gate? he joins us on the telephone with his thoughts. good to have you with us. >> glad to be with you. >> when you were with the other ceos at the white house, does it jive with what we're hearing about that made mitch mcconnell laugh yesterday? are those two plans one in the same? >> well, i'm hopeful that what's happening in the media is posturing by both parties and doesn't reflect where either party thinks a deal will end up. i think what the president talked with us about on wednesday afternoon was much more a sense of where things ought to end up, and that was, i think, somewhat different than it sounds like what was proposed. >> so you didn't hear about the tax increase for the wealthiest, the spending increases that made mitch mcconnell laugh. those specifics you didn't get into with the president on wednesday, is that what you're saying? >> we certainly talked with the president and heard from the the pre
for the american people that extends tax cuts to the american people. brings our long-term deficits down. tough spending savings is part of that, and invest in things that matter to the american economy, like infrastructure, and getting americans back to work. we think we can do that. we have a good chance, and it's very important. and i think we'll get there, david. >> do you think we'll get a deal by the end of the year? >> i do. because the only thing standing in the way of that is a refusal by republicans to accept that rates have to go up on the wealthiest americans. and i don't really see them doing that. >> the idea that they have signalled something significant for them, which is -- >> what is that? >> putting revenue on the table. >> it's welcome that they are recognizing that revenues are going to have to go up. but they haven't told us anything about how far rates should go up, how far revenues should go up, who should pay higher taxes. >> republicans have said that no republicans will vote for a tax rate increase. do you think they are just bluffing? >> i can't tell you what they ar
is the problem? we cannot raise taxes enough to take care of $1 trillion worth of deficit spending every single year. so let's get off of this and get on to the other side and start talking about what we have to do to cut our spending, to reform those entitlement programs that are the debt drivers and then do pro-growth tax reform that will stimulate the economy, get the money coming in. it's the best way to get money coming in and that gives everybody a job and helps to take care of the fiscal problem and balanced is what we need. >> congresswoman diane black, thank you for joining me this morning. i appreciate your time. >> thank you. >> i want to bring in our political power panel. political reporter, karen tumult, karen finney and robert trainam. karen, since i know you the best, i'm going to call you k-fin as not to confuse everyone. it seems the taxes are going to go up on the wealthy. the question is whether or not it's through the tax increases or closing the loopholes and the deductions. so do you think that we are closer to a deal today than yesterday if. >> i do. in that now they're
't really think that social security has really ever been a cause of the deficit. there's more funds coming in than there is funds being sent out in checks. and this whole security tax is a separate tax from the federal tax. and -- host: so this proposal includes the extension of the payroll tax cut. what do you think of that proposal? >> i think that's fine. i think extending the payroll tax is probably something we're going to have to look at doing. but when they start talking about using social security money, that botters me, because social security is never needed -- has never needed federal dollars before to fund the program. host: ok. off of twitter this is reding who says they have not offered a deficit reduction plan. republican big pledges tax reform and closing unspecified tax loopholes. arthur, good morning. go ahead. what do you think about the proposedal? caller: i think the proposal is kind of ludacris. but i really think that the republicans should back away. they should take their people, stand back and let the democrats have their way and let them do what they want to do
the deficit? same question as when should ben bernanke start raising interest rates. he told us there is 2014, inflation is not a problem. you don't see it. is that this a problem? why is the ten year treasury just one.6%? whar the bond vigilante's? no one worries about the deficit right now. they're worried about a slow-growth economy. cheryl: using markets have already priced in the fiscal cliff arguments but why do we see markets get so volatile when john boehner comes out, are almost afraid to see him talk again today because senator reid comes out and down and up. so much reaction. >> you can't rule out the risk that nothing is done and they don't reach an agreement and if taxes go up and spending is cut we will be in a recession next year. and employment 9%, we can't rule that out but it doesn't make sense to let that happen for the administration, the principal of punishing the wealthy is enough to allow the rest of the country to go into a funk doesn't make sense. cheryl: we see numbers and taxing the top 2% do nothing to deal with the overall deficit problem but you also think at the
party is being realistic about the enormity of the debt and deficit issue. what you just described is a very easy deal. it is sitting on the table, most of it is automatic. of the deal isn't reached in any case which is going to prompt something getting worked out but we need to cut about more than that. we are spending 23% of our gdpp federal government is, in one fashion or another and taking in 18% and that is not going to change all that much with the outlines of this deal. the democrats are not realistic about how much has to be cut and republicans are not realistic about how much taxes need to go. connell: the democratic side of it since we're speaking with you and delve into that a little more. if you are right about certain aspects of this, if dagen mcdowell and me can come after the president said he wanted the one$.6 trillion in revenue and say you wants $1.2 trillion because john boehner had $800 billion on the table last times those with the difference we are not exactly political geniuses all the respected political but anyone could have written that story and come up
, congress realized that if they couldn't compromise on a deficit and revenue plan, our economy would crash. turns out they couldn't compromise. so here's what they did. in order to force themselves to work together and compromise, they concocted a catastrophic penalty that would itself crash our economy. brilliant. put it another way. if there is an asteroid headed towards the earth, we made it and fired it at ourselves. because otherwise we would never have done the hard work required to protect ourselves from asteroids. >> good morning. it's friday, november 30th. welcome to "morning joe." with us on set, we have msnbc political analyst and vice president and executive editor of msnbc.com, richard wolffe is here. >> he's here? >> my lord. right here on the set. political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington post, sam stein. >> hi. >> cute thing. and msnbc political analyst and visiting professor at nyu and former democratic congressman harold ford jr. >> good morning. >> good morning. >> he's reading. >> put that down right now. put the smut down. close it up. >> i'm l
's on a deficit crusade. david walker, taxes ranger, next. toward all your financial goals. a quick glance, and you can see if you're on track. when the conversation turns to knowing where you stand, turn to us. wells fargo advisors. the latest coffee machine from nespresso. modular. intuitive. combines espresso and fresh milk. the new u. nespresso. what else? available at these fine retailers. who have used androgel 1%, there's big news. presenting androgel 1.62%. both are used to treat men with low testosterone. androgel 1.62% is from the makers of the number one prescribed testosterone replacement therapy. it raises your testosterone levels, and... is concentrated, so you could use less gel. and with androgel 1.62%, you can save on your monthly prescription. [ male announcer ] dosing and application sites between these products differ. women and children should avoid contact with application sites. discontinue androgel and call your doctor if you see unexpected signs of early puberty in a child, or, signs in a woman which may include changes in body hair or a large increase in acne, pos
benefits to help reduce the other deficits. >> to be clear that's one thing that's clearly off the table. social security is off the tables in these negotiations. >> in a separate process to strengthen social security not as a process to reduce the deficit. >>> on the issues of taxes, is there any flexibility on the president's position? does it have to go all the way back to the tax rates on the wealthy to the clinton levels? >> again, george, we think the best way to do this is to have those tax rates go back to where and one of the best, at one of the most prosperous times in recent american history to combine that reforms that limit reductions for 2%, i'm deeply skeptical about ways to get through this without that mix of rates and reforms. >> and if congress doesn't agree, you're comfortable going over that cliff on january 1st? >> there's no reason why 98% of americans have to see their taxes go up because some members of congress on the republican side want to block tax rate increase for 2% of the wealthy americans. remember, those tax cuts cost a trillion dollars over ten years.
, that another really important part of this conversation in addition to long term deficit reduction is making sure that we get sustained economic recovery. we saw some good numbers today, but we want to make sure that we sustain that recovery. and extending middle class text cuts is part of it, but so is investing in our infrastructure, so are other elements of the president's jobs plan that should be part of this overall agreement. >> we have seen several liberal democrats to say that it is better to go off that cliff than to get a bad deal. and i'm wondering if you agree because it seems like the ceos who came out of the meeting with the president yesterday were most worried or at least seriously worried about the effect of not getting a deal on time and the effect that will have on the economy. >> we absolutely want to avoid going over the fiscal cliff because it would be a big drag on the economy. >> but are you willing to do that? >> what we're willing to do is come up with a package that both accelerates economic recovery, but also begins to reduce the long term deficit and the presiden
. >> -- that we are willing to do the hard things required to reduce the testify sit. we want to raise -- deficit. we want to raise taxes, cut defense -- we're willing to do all four of those things. megyn: marc, how does taking money out of medicare and giving it to obamacare cut spending? [laughter] >> it doesn't. >> that's not what i said, megyn. that's not what i said. >> it doesn't cut spending. they cut money out of medicare and put it to fund obamacare, but president obama has not put forward a plan to deal with the entitlement crisis. he put forward no plan on social security, medicare or medicaid, which he himself admits is what is driving the debt and driving the real fiscal crisis. so they have put forward no plans whatsoever, and when paul ryan and others have put forward our plans, they've pilied them for it. i'm glad president obama's meeting with simon. i'd love for him to meet with john john boehner. [laughter] megyn: simon's got a lot of good ideas. were you in that meeting with the unions and the progressive groups that the president had -- >> no. i was in a different meeting. t
that doubled the tax hikes that he campaigned on and it adds about $150 billion more, not less to the deficit in and new spending. to republicans with that kind of equivalent of lucy and the football and they are laying flat on their backs? >> republicans scoffed at this first foray from the white house. they thought was ridiculous. for the white house it was the first attempt, first specific plan we've seen since the election being put out there. it was frankly a wish list. john boehner acknowledges as much in his comments was that the white house would like to see. if we do get a deal before christmas it won't look anything like this. >> gregg: instead of meeting with members of congress, even day after day and tens of thousands of dollars the president doesn't do that. the president heads back on the campaign trail gives speeches about it. how frustrating is this to some of the folks on capitol hill who do want to sit down and work with him? >> i think it's frustrating to some members of congress, perhaps members of his own party more than anything. if you look at his record he doesn't do
time than next year to work together on a comprehensive plan to bring down the deficits. >> white house spokesman jay carney broke new ground declaring today the president does want spending cuts, listed in his budget plan to be included in the fiscal cliff talks. >> hold up the budget and say democrats on capitol hill vote for including the spending cuts in this deal to avoid the fiscal cliff. that is not what they are doing now. should they include those? >> yes. i think that, and i know that democrats accept that this has to be it, a balanced package, that includes revenues and cuts and spending cuts. >> months ago, the budget carney held up was voted down by the entire senate. 99-0. meaning no democratic support. earlier, dick durbin insisted spending cuts from entitlement reform will not be part of the talks while pelosi spell noncommittal whether the cuts will be in the deal. still, the administration is trying to breathe life to the talks, with vice president biden shopping at new costco in washington, picking up a big screen tv and apple pie and insisting he is optimistic of a d
spending her hard-earned tax dollars like water, running trillion-dollar deficits year after year. she's angry and she has every right to be angry. so what are we going to do about it? lately we've heard a lot of talk about raising revenues, but not nearly enough talk about bringing the federal government down to the right size, about matching spending to the resources we have, about balancing the federal budget. oh, we hear about a balanced approach, but that's just a way of saying we need to increase taxes. actually, we don't need to increase taxes. the best thing we could do would be to not increase taxes. the best thing we can do is to raise revenues by making our economy as healthy and strong as it can be. that means we need to help our businesses grow and hire. that's become way too hard to do in the past couple of years. a businessman in duchess county, new york, said he's going to have to limit the number of employees he has to less than 50 so he won't be subject to penalties under the 2010 health law. so right now the federal government is keeping him from offering jobs. that
a balanced approach to deficit reduction that doesn't hurt the economy and doesn't hurt middle class families. if we agree that we should not raise taxes on middle class families, let's begin our work with where we agree. >> of course there are some lawmakers who are not that optimistic. they don't think there's enough time between now and the end of the year to get a deal done. nonetheless the president will continue pushing his message. he heads to pennsylvania tomorrow. he will go to a manufacturing plant where he will continue talking about extending the middle class tax cuts, not extending them for the upper class americans. in the meantime, there's pushback from republicans who are saying the president should not be out the road campaigning but back here in washington negotiating. >> dan, i will ask you to look into your crystal ball. president obama is meeting with mitt romney later today. do you have any idea what they plan to discuss? >> you know, there's a lot of speculation about governor romney playing a role in the administration. but the president himself, during his victory spe
to bring down our deficits and stream line tax. including asking the wealthiest americans to pay more for education and train science and research. >> any republican who buys this is a fool. republicans have stood for one thing statistically that held them. they are the low tax party. the other guys want to tax to match their reckless spending. if they give it up now in return for nothing, obama wins and high wins big. i understand why the democrats are doing this. they imagine that republicans have no bargaining power today . i say that it is true if republicans resist they will take the blame and that will help democrats in the congress. but obama's never running again. he doesn't care who gets the blame. he is the president and a blame duck. he wants a successful second term. if it starts by going over the cliff it starts with second recession and wrecked second term. >> steve: that's why the president said i would be willing to do anything to get a deal. >> gretchen: it is not a deal. this is what the american public needs to know. this is raising taxos successful people and reduc
. >> do you briyou believe if you rote deficit -- two different ways. you either keep the government that you have and pay for it by raising taxes, or you kind of leave taxes where they are and you shrink government down to where it pays for it. does it matter for the future and for growth which way you do it in your view? >> it does. if you put it all into like a tightening, so how much tightening occurs in the economy that would slow the economy, it's far better to actually reduce government spending than it is to actually raise taxes. >> although that hurts the economy, too. >> everything hurts the economy. so it's a question of which is most -- or least harmful and that tends to be cutting government spending. >> but i do think it's -- >> although tim geithner would disagree with me. >> one side wants to keep the government and entitlements like we have it. and the other side wants to take away all the excess government -- >> i think both sides agree that you need to do both. just a question of how much. >> we need to do both to do a deal. i don't think both sides dwre that it's
. we need to get serious about our deficit and debt that are burying our children's future. [ man ] ring ring... progresso this reduced sodium soup says it mahelp lower cholesterol, how does it work? you just he to eat it as part of your heart healthy diet. step 1. eat the soup. all those veggies and beans, that's what may help lower your cholesterol and -- well that's easy [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup. martha: we have brand-new details on the deadly bus crash that happened in florida. police say the bus driver was confused and lost when he chose the wrong route coming out of miami airport. the top of the bus crumpled after the crash and killed two passengers. it had 32 jehovah's church members on board, they were heading to a conference. bill: if you wash watching "fox news sunday" john boehner described his reaction when the president presented its plan for the fiscal cliff. > >> i said you can't be serious. we have 7 weeks went election and the end of the year and three those weeks have been wasted. bill: flabbergasted, rich. wasting time. three weeks
of how we fix our national deficit. as you well know, we face the fiscal cliff, a series of tax hikes and spending cuts that many people think if they go into effect will put the country into recession. yet we heard the treasury secretary tim geithner say the president is willing to see the country go off the fiscal cliff if republicans do not accede to his demands. >> it's probably pretty real. but you can't get to where we need to go by cutting spending, that won't cut it. you're going to destroy a fragile economy. you can't get there by taxing your way into it and you can't grow your way out of this. you have to have a blend. when you have leaders of parties and people from the administration saying i think it will be to the advantage of the democrats to go off the cliff or i think it will be advantage to the republicans to go off the cliff or the president to go off the cliff, that's like betting your country. there's stupidity involved in that. this is big-time stuff. >> let me ask you about a report that some republicans now are perhaps willing to see the tax rates rise to some
will still continue to raise our deficit beyond unbelievable numbers you can't even find on your calculator. >> my hope is to get this done before christmas. >> you might call this thelma and louise economics. >> our country doesn't need a victory lap. it needs photo-op. >> i don't think they're going to take pictures. >> extraordinary financial gifts. >> he did a terrific job running the olympics. >> worked agris sifly to turn them out to vote. >> if it was president bill clinton ideas might actually be exchanged. what percentage of people watching right now think proev is going to offer mitt romney secretary of commerce? >> play my jam! ♪ >> i got my costco card. >> three packs of shirt from costco. >> americans want to celebrate christmas not the holidays. >> except if you go to brown university. >> they think there's a made-up war on christmas. there is a war on christmas. >> i don't look down on you. i don't think you're a pinhead. why are you messing around with christmas. >> don't tell me what i think. >> nothing says christmas like santa and ak-47s. >> when i sing "white christmas
we've got $16 trillion debt. we've got a deficit every year of $1 trillion or more -- >> i'm saying the savings are in pharmaceuticals. >> where are the cuts? >> we can cut by not paying the maximum price to the pharmaceuticals. the savings is located in that. i don't know how much money they've said we can raise in these other areas. social security is not a part of our deficit problem. so the only other two entitlements we got is how to detake care of the poor, and if we don't take care of the poor, it means additional expenses. >> would you be in favor of means testing medicare and social security? in other words, taking those wealthy americans who don't need those benefits and take them off those roles as a savings? >> there's no question that removing the cap for higher people that are in the higher income is one of the sources of income that i could support. no question about that. >> let me ask you this, congress pan. would you prefer top just deal with the revenue and forget about cutting at all at this point because of the slow economy? is that where you're headed here? >>
out sensible spending cuts that must be part of any significant agreement that will reduce our deficit. >> the president has put forward in september of 2011 with his proposal to the so-called super committee and his budget of february of 2011 very specific spending cuts, including savings from health care entitlement programs. >> so one of the issues is, when you talk specifics and they become part of the public conversation, it's very easy for those things to get derailed in the time available where all the sides sort of clamber and attack some of the specifics. both parties have an interest in keeping some of this close to the vest. what we're hearing from senate democrats today is they believe that the election suggests that the public really wants those higher rates for the higher earners in terms of taxes. senator reid and other democrats don't want to talk about specific cuts or entitlement reforms publicly. everyone saying they don't want to negotiate from the podium. but everyone is aware it's the end of november. there isn't a lot of time left. and how quickly and how peacefu
and negotiations are about deficit reduction. president obama thinks they're about fairness. most americans, solid majority, want to see taxes raised on those upper income americans, even though only 19% think it will have much of an impact on deficits. it's not about the fiscal crisis. it's about fairness in the minds of most americans. president obama understands that and republicans don't. >> is that because in your polling day, i always thought that people favored spending reduction and favored smaller government. this may be a mistake that the gop has not emphasized spending cuts. >> they certainly do. most people -- two out of three people want to see a deal that includes both tax hikes and spending cuts. they want to see more spending cuts, but they don't expect spending cuts to come out of this no matter what happens. in fact, the one thing that most people in the middle class believe is that regardless of whether we go over the fiscal cliff or whether a deal is reached to avert that, middle class taxes are going up, and so is spending. so there's a lot of cynicism in this process. >> real
help in the push to reduce the deficit. the problem, stalled proposals to replace the expired program include billions of dollars in cuts to food stamps. the senate bill would shave $4.5 billion from the program over ten years. the house version would slash $16 billion over the same time period. the congressional budget office estimates the house bill would throw upwards of $3 million people off the food stamp roles and hundreds of thousands of children denied free school lunches. needless to say the cuts could not come at a worst time for recipients. as of august, 47 million people americans relied on food stamps to keep from going hungry up from 31 million just four years ago. joining me on set, the author of "the juice," and in the nation's capitol, cnbc's chief washington correspondent, john harwood. we have our sage of capitol hill luke russert on set here. you're holding it down in the nation's capital. in firms of the discussions of the fiscal cliff, the white house is focused solely on cuts for top earners. almost no discussion of unemployment insurance and payroll taxes, the
know, one thing is we take a huge bite out of the deficit. we do it in a crude may, and there would be immediate attempts to fix it and fine-tune it and take some back. some would probably get through. if you actually want to look at it from a policy standpoint, it may not be the worst possible option to just go over the cliff and then put back in the tax cuts and the spending increases or renewals that you'd like to put back in. so, you know, worst things could happen. >> well, listen, alan simpson and i go back to his sound from the "today" show, eugene. he said anyone talking about it in that way, there's stupidity involved. he didn't say, eugene, you better not because you're my buddy, but the reality is even our first read team says this notion or all of this media hype about going off the cliff from some of our colleagues is overstated. to their point a deal is in sight, that's why boehner and the president spoke yesterday. it's a matter of how big. will they separate the tax cuts from a larger needed plan later down the road? i guess what you folks in d.c. like to call "kicki
-chair of the president's deficit commission, was on the "today" show this morning and he said all this talk about either side being able to go off the cliff is ridiculous. let me play that for you. >> when you have leaders of parties and people from the administration saying i think it would be to the advantage of the democrats to go off the cliff or i think it will be advantage to the republicans to go off the cliff or the president to go off the cliff, that's like betting your country. there's stupidity involved in that. this is big time stuff. >> and there's also a question of how far the white house is willing to go to protect middle class tax cuts. are they willing to limit unemployment insurance, give up infrastructure spending, which is something the president has been talking about from the beginning, payroll tax cut. what's the white house plan here? >> well, alan simpson in addition to being an excellent dancer is a very shrewd political analyst. >> very hip, alan simpson. >> very, very, very good dancer recently. but, look, i think people talk in terms of political advantage and clearly the p
deficit plan had savings worth pursuing. >> they identified $1.1 trillion tax expenditures, benefits, deductions, credits and the like that could be cut as part of a grand bargain. i think we ought to look at that flat ten the code simplify it. >> harry reid told reporters yesterday he would like to get credit for what congress has previously cut. >> we have already done more than a billion dollars worth of cuts. >> the top democrat in the house took a similar approach. >> it is important to know that we have already agreed to over a trillion and a half dollars in cuts at both budget control and others in this session of congress. so now we are looking to see if we can do that. >> though asked what she would be willing to slash as part of this deal rank and file house members say they realize more must be done now. >> we get a senfolks making a mn dollars a year maybe they aren't able to access medicare. they have the means to buy their own healthcare. >> i know we can't afford to spend 690 billion on our defense but there are smart ways and dumb ways to cut defense spending. we have
agreed we should have a balanced approach to deficit reduction that doesn't hurt the economy and doesn't hurt middle class families. if both parties agree we should not raise taxes on middle class families let's begin our work with where we agree. >> americans are concerned. but divided over the best solution to avoid the fiscal cliff. take a look at an abc news washington post poll that shows 60% of americans support upper income americans having their taxes raised. 37% oppose it. on issue of reducing deductions, 44% support that. 49% oppose it. much like lawmakers they realize there is a big problem that needs to be fixed but divided on how to fix it. >> in addition to the goings on in the capitol there is a big lunch at the white house today. governor romney coming by for a bite to eat. a lot of speculation about what might be discussed at the meal and the possibility of maybe future job? >> jay carney pushed back on that yesterday. the president said there was no suggestion here that he had a special assignment for him. the president invited mitt romney to come to the white house b
address the fiscal cliff. any plan to reduce the deficit should quote start small and then grow very substantially over time. so dudley basically agreeing with the take that sandy is a bigger event, and then you want to add on top of that dudley's concerns about the fiscal cliff coming our way. >> what does this mean for the retailers because right now we have the impact of sandy, because they're confined pretty much to november. we had this seasonally strong period for retail sales especially for the holiday season. but does that mean the kruk -- money is being spent instead on gypsum board and other materials that need to be bought for reconstruction? >> there is a big disconnect here, we had terrific consumer confidence numbers, so i think the nation itself should be stronger. the high income areas, remember, these were high income areas, a lot of times we're used to storms not hitting the high income. but i do think that we're going to see it pushed to 2013. this is not fukushima where they just decided they couldn't rebuild. this is major areas that once we get the materials are
are in a deficit situation, as people have been discussing the past several weeks so there are potential in congress for the house and senate members. >> eric: billions of dollars. of taxpayers money that goes to the u.n. ambassador bolton, thank you for your insight. >> guest: thank you, eric. >> jamie: a fox news extreme weather alert. flood in effect for the west coast. yet another storm is approaching. folks are preparing for worst. severe weather threatening to bring more rain to an area that is already been drenched. chief meteorologist rick reichmuth live from the fox news extreme weather center. if you know rick is hanging out, it must be serious. how bad? >> really bad. this is the second batch of storms they have had this month. earlier in month, a lot of areas saw ten plus inchs of rain. now we have had another series of storms last week where we have seen ten plus inches of rain. the ground is saturated. this storm is windy. windy conditions across colorado, spreading across the intermountain west. the ground is saturated, if you take that wind and we will see more trees goin
. not this president. when you look at the debt and deficits he run up. he run up more debt than all of the other presidents combined and maybe the republicans should let the president go ahead and sail off of the cliff and do it for the next generation. keep in mind, somebody may have to pay the bill it may be our children and our children's children. do we want to leave the country in better shape. >> gretchen: they will not have enough pennies in the piggy bank. moments ago kate middleton and prince william left the hospital. she was admitted on monday after suffering from acute morning sickness. kate was treated by the queens doctors. she is headed to kensington palace where she will rest for a extended time. the rogue nation of syria has begun mixing chemical weapons and loading them in to bombs. it is raising fears that president assad will use them on his own people. >> if he would drop the gas, it would kill 100,000 people immediately and in damascus a million people could be affected. it is very serious. >> gretchen: fox news learns that the military drawing up contingency plans in case
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